Western New York Herpetological Society

Question and Answers

by Will Still

If you have a "Herp" related question, (feeding, care, lighting, heating, ect.)  We will post the question and answers here.   You can summit your questions at the bottom of this page using the form.

 QUESTION - How do I know the right temp to keep my herps at?



 ANSWER--The most accurate answer is that there is no one temperature that reptiles of any species require.  All reptiles and amphibians are ectotherms, meaning that they are unable to produce usable heat internally like mammals can.  Because of this fact, they must all utilize micro-habitats within their environment that reach or (more typically) exceed the temperatures that they need to digest food, shed, allow eggs to develop, etc. 

We as keepers cannot possibly know what these animals need at any given moment, so it is our job to give the critters in our care broad choices so that they are able to select the temperatures that they require at any given time.  These choices are often referred to as a temperature gradient, which is a gradual transition from cool to warm across the the horizontal or vertical plane of the enclosure.  However, temperature gradients are difficult to achieve in most captive set-ups and are not needed. 

What is needed is a large cool area within the cage and a relatively small hot area (generally, just large enough to quickly heat up the entire body of the animal).  This is important, because in reality, most herps seek hot temperatures for brief intervals to complete specific tasks and carry out their daily movements in cool areas.  Exceptions are when animals are seeking warm temperatures for extended periods of time to heal an injury, digest, shed or to support developing eggs.  Extended cool seeking exceptions will be noticed when animals are preparing for reproduction.  As sperm die or deform and ovarian follicles don't develop at temperatures that are too great. 

We can see examples of heat seeking behavior in wild herps during their active seasons through close observation.  Snakes will often bask in the direct sun for short periods of time in the summer and then move on to hunt.  We can find snakes under warm cover for longer periods of time during cooler parts of the day or season, when it takes the ground longer to provide them with the temperatures that they need.  Turtles are the same way.  In the heat of the summer day, they will crawl onto a log and briefly bask, before resuming foraging behavior.  But in the morning, late afternoon or spring we may see them basking for longer periods of time while they try to achieve operating temperatures.  During cooler times, these animals bask in the open longer because they have to, it is not a choice, it is not safe and it causes them the stress that we should avoid at all costs in captivity.   

The type of basking behaviors that we should try to accommodate in captivity are brief periods of warm seeking behavior followed by cool seeking behavior.  This is characterized by frequent movement within the cage between warm and cool areas.  When this movement is noticed, the keeper has achieved appropriate temperature balance and his or her animals will be able to metabolize food, avoid obesity and carry out life events such as feeding, breeding and shedding.  If a herp is sitting on the heat source all day, the heat source is not warm enough.  If the animal is hugging the cool side all day or pacing, the cage is too warm overall.  These generalizations hold true for all herps from diamond pythons to dart frogs and every species in between. 

Depending on the natural metabolism of the animal in question, the highs and lows will vary, but the range should be wide for all species.  All snakes will select and use temperatures between 60 and 100 F.  All monitors will select and use temps between 70 and 150F.  Dart frogs have successfully utilized temps in my terrariums between 65 and 90F. Turtles will select and use temps between 60 and 110. 

Even though we cannot have a temperature gradient reflecting these ranges in our cages, we can have a hot spot that reaches the upper range and a large enough cool section to choose safe resting ares under cover.  Generally, the less experience a keeper has, the greater the range he or she should offer.  Once a keeper reaches a greater experience level, these ranges can be reduced slightly. Because once we get a better feel for the animal's needs, we can customize our enclosures and choices more appropriately. 

In the wild, these animals do not live at one temperature, they spend their days and nights moving between a wide range of temperatures to meet their operating needs.  It should be our goal as keepers to offer a broad enough range to allow our charges to complete the tasks that they were designed to do.  Good luck!

QUESTION- I'm trying to start my own herp business building terrariums and breeding dart frogs.  I was just wondering if/what permits i would need to legally breed and sell frogs and also ship them in the USA?

ANSWER-  In NYS there are no legal restrictions that would prevent you from breeding and selling dart frogs commercially.  Specific cities, towns and villages within the state may have restrictions regarding non-traditional pets, but there is nothing to stop you at the state level. 

Many species are easy to breed and are very prolific to boot.  I personally bred Dendrobates azeurus for several years and a couple of generations in my 6th grade classroom.  My students fed the frogs and cared for the tadpoles.  My adult female frogs would lay eggs weekly.  At one point we had several hundreds tadpoles to care for and ease of maintenance became a priority (something to consider). My good friend Aaron Handzlik at Aaron's Frog Farm has been successfully breeding and selling dart and other frogs as a full time business for well over a decade.  He is a leader in the field and a wealth of knowledge and experience.  I also believe that he is a club member, get to know him.

The factors to consider above and beyond actual frog care and production are shipping and marketing.  Shipping can be done with either Fed-Ex, Ship Your Reptiles (Pro Exotics) and Delta.  They all accept frogs, and with proper packing procedures and well insulated boxes, shipping darts is no big deal.  Their are several on-line communities with classified sections where you could advertise frogs, plants and feeders to reach a national (or larger) market. Also, you would be wise to develop a rapport with some of our local herp dealing petshops.  Many of them sell dart frogs and accessories (fruit flies & terrarium goods) and having the ability to wholesale surplus stock locally is a big bonus.   Holding out for the big retail bucks is an attractive option until you find yourself sitting on a thousand froglets during a slow month.  It sure is nice to be able to sell them in twenty lots to a local shop or a national dealer.

Terrarium construction and maintenance is a relatively un-tapped field, locally anyway.  More and more professional offices are hiring firms to set-up and maintain tropical and reef aquaria.  It is only a matter of time before someone runs with the idea of doing the same with terrariums, especially since established terrariums are virtually maintenance free, unlike messy fish tanks.  Basically a terrarium "specialist" would have to feed the frogs and trim the plants. Consider that most folks in the non-herp keeping world don't even know that living jungles, with colonies of dart frogs shrouded in mist, mosses and ferns is even possible.  It won't be a secret for long, someone is going to do it, why not you?  Good luck.

QUESTION-I was wondering the most fitable reptile to start a breeding program.  Im also, going to start a business with them.

ANSWER-Good for you!  More pet keepers should try their hand at pairing up and reproducing the herps in their care.  These animals entire lives are based on the drive to recruit and reproduce the next generation.  Female herps of many species frequently die of reproductive system failure because their keepers did not allow them to do the one job that mother nature requires - make babies!  I applaud you efforts, go for it.

The easiest answer to your excellent question is to work with whatever species interests you the most.  I am a firm believer that folks put the most time, effort and care into the animals that truly captivate them.  However, in our current economic and political climate, we must consider the other factors that must be overcome in order to realize success.  To that end, I would modify my original answer and advise you to work with animals that interest you, are legal to possess, breed and sell, have a viable market, and fall within your skill set as a keeper.

We have already covered the first factor, so assuming you are considering a species that you have a great interest or passion for, I would check your state and national regs to make sure that working with your critters of choice will not cause you any legal hassles.  The animal police keep a close eye on the on-line classifieds and are more than willing to set up and take down folks whose business practices take them beyond the boundaries of the law.  Don't do it, it isn't worth it.

The next factor to consider is the potential market for any offspring that you produce.  These days there are many outlets for quality excess offspring and your choices range from the previously mentioned on-line classifieds, to local pet shops, to national wholesale outlets. However, even with all of these options, you must still consider if people will want to buy the species that you are offering, at least at a level that will allow you to earn enough profit to stay in business.  While all herp species are great, many don't generate enough interest in the captive bred market to warrant the space, time and money that a focused breeding program will require.  Savannah monitors are a great example.  While they are an awesome species, there is simply not enough interest in captive bred savs to make it worth your while, as anyone with access to a computer can find them for little more than $10.00 each as imports.  Even if you are in the honorable and valued business of creating and disseminating life, you will quickly fail if you are unable to both find homes for your babies and pay the very real hard costs of producing and caring for offspring and breeding stock.

Finally, you must ask yourself if you have the experience, skill and financial wherewithal to actually produce the species that you are setting out to.  Decisions based solely on good intentions die hard and quickly in herpetoculture.  One must have the skill to get the ball rolling and keep it rolling, so to speak.  I would not advise anyone with limited experience to jump into a project with a rare or complex taxon.  Luck happens, but not with any consistency in this business.  You must understand the basics of good husbandry, reproductive cycles, gestational care, egg incubation and care of neonates before you begin.  Reading is great, but it doesn't hold a candle to real-time experience with live animals.  Do some leg-work and find out who the players are in your field and model their successes while at the same time recognize where failure can get you. Start off modestly and build your collection and your business as you gain confidence and experience.  Buy the best stock you can afford as the best parents usually create the best babies, and the best babies sell...well, the best. Most importantly, make integrity your primary goal and make sure all of your customers are satisfied, even if their satisfaction means that you have to replace animals or money. That is how a good name in this business is made and kept.  Good luck.

QUESTION-First, I would like to know the most effective/nutritious foods to feed it.  Also what do I do when the turtle starts shedding or peeling? How much water should be kept in the aquarium and is it necessary to have a dry area for the turtle as well?

ANSWER-Painted turtles are a very commonly kept species and they are relatively easy to care for as long as a few simple rules are followed.  First however, I must advise you that the NY DEC does not allow the keeping of any native reptiles or amphibians without a state issued permit, so please make every effort to assure that your turtle is being kept legally. 

Painted turtles thrive in conditions that include a sizable cage for swimming and basking, clean water and a hot area to dry off and achieve operating temperatures.  I have found that concrete mixing tubs sold at any of the home improvement stores make great, inexpensive turtle enclosures.  They are sturdy and provide a large, usable area in which your painter can bask and swim.  Add to that a good power filter to keep the water clean between weekly water changes and a large, secure basking platform on which the turtle will dry off and get warm and you've got your set-up.  The basking area is critical, as the heat it provides will allow your turtle to digest food, maintain its immune system, and kill any pathogens on the shell or skin.  This platform should be heated by a small floodlight (45-50w)which will allow the basking area to achieve a temperature of at least 100F.  The area heated by the bulb (the sweet spot) should be at least the diameter of the turtle's shell.  Without a hot, dry basking area, painteds, as well as most aquatic turtles, will quickly succumb to bacterial or fungal infections.  The shedding of the large, outer shell scutes that you mentioned is the first sign that your turtle is not being allowed to get hot enough.  In the summer, a hot basking area is easily achieved by maintaining your turtle outside, in a secure area.  Remember however that if you maintain your turtle outdoors, you must also assure that the animal has access to shade.  This can be achieved by covering half of the cage.  In the cooler months, supplemental heat must be provided or your turtle will suffer.  This is not optional.

Luckily, painted turtles are generalist feeders that will do well with a broad diet that includes aquatic plants such as anacharis (found in any tropical fish store or water garden shop), earthworms, snails, fish, crickets, or thawed pink mice.  I have personally found that feeding fish fouls the water more quickly and drastically than other protein sources and makes maintenance a greater hassle than it needs to be.  Earthworms are like prime rib to turtles and they do very well on this complete food source.  You may certainly feed any of the prepared, commercial turtle foods, but I would advise against making these products the sole diet, as they are not a true complete food like a whole animal would be.

Enjoy your painted turtle!  They are a very beautiful and easy to care for species that thrives in captivity as long as they can swim in clean water, bask on a hot platform and enjoy a complete diet.  Good luck!


 QUESTION- I have searched every avenue to get clear defined answers about breeding reptiles.  I was wondering what licensing or permits are required to breed and sell reptiles in NY?

ANSWER-Congrats on your decision to look into a breeding project.  NYS wildlife laws can essentially be divided into three caterories of animals that would be off-limits for a captive breeding project. 

The first of which are herps that are indiginous to the state.  If they live here, you can't legally keep them without a permit.  Permits are perportedly given for a very few research projects and would likely not be granted to you for a for-profit venture...so forget about anything that calls NYS home.

Next on the do not keep list are animals that are considered venomous.  You are not allowed to persue any venomous project without a state sanctioned permit.  These permits are also not acquired with ease. When our state venomous laws first took effect, all you really had to do was fill out an application, pay the fee and an annual permit was granted.  Those days are gone.

Finally, are the restricted reptiles that NYS recently prohibited because of their dangerous size or attributes, such as Burmese, Indian, reticulated, African rock, and scrub pythons.  All anacondas are also included on the list of large constrictors. Crocodile, Nile, white and black throat monitors are also included, as well as all crocodilians, and the alligator snapping turtle.

Most other herps are allowed, as far as the state is concerned. However, check with your local municipality for specific local laws. 

Seriously, even considering all of these state road-blocks, these are still several thousand reptiles and amphibians that you can legally work with in NYS.  Choose animals that are not over-represented in the hobby yet still maintain great appeal for you.  Good luck.